DwD Studios

Same stats but 2 levels in thief and 2 levels in spell caster.
+10 to attack
4D+15 damage.

:) Cool!

Very cool! Of course as soon as the glowing/shiny/on-fire arrow flies it could be noticed revealing the attackers location. ;-)

Neat start on a list of ultra-powerful archetypes.

Hidden Halfling Assassin 70, dagger 1D+3, leather armor DR2, shortbow 2D+4 with one fire-arrow (70% 4D+4 bypass DR).

Remember that casting and attacking are each an action. So if you want it done in the same turn, then you cast OS with no penalty and then attack with -20 penalty, so that you only get a total +10 attack bonus. But it is still good.

Make him an enchanter, prep the runes on the arrowhead ahead of time. Add a few levels of Warrior so he doesn't just flat out miss.

Or cast before the battle/encounter negating the penalty.

Any weapon can be charged and the effect will be unleashed on the next successful attack.

It's possible to find an arrow still charged cast years ago. :-)

Ahhh.

heh heh heh

That's an interesting thought. Would an enchanter have to prepare and leave a Temp rune on a weapon to do that? Or could he "cast" it, charge the weapon, then prepare another temporary rune? My son's friend has an Enchanter, so I'm wondering how that'd work.

Another question also comes to mind.... how many can you prepare? A whole quiver full of arrows? Just one? A number equal to spellcaster level? That could get messy. Even a level one spellcaster archer type could sit and boost up all his arrows at night before bed. Even with 30 or 40% skill, he could just recast until he gets them all and add 2D per arrow....

Temp Runes fade upon the death of the caster if the Rules as written are used. Also, the caster can have no more than two Runes per Enchanter level untriggered, so unless Houseruled it seems there are limits...

I'm having trouble enough with Enchanters as is, mind. One PC hailing from one of the Islands asked me if he could have a one-man Coracle in place of a horse or mule for his pick-and while a Skiff is out of his price range, a Coracle is just bent willow lashing, skins and tar and meant to be carried on one's back, so why not?

THEN he offered to trade in all his other picks and 10 STR for a minor Enchantment, Transport Level 1. Normally I would just say NO, but after deliberation (this is a 'kick the tires' Playtest after all) I made him roll and spend all his picks on a minor 2 Point Cost Enchant(minor, semi-portable).Natuarally he rolls '00' (he WOULD!) so I ask him to add a Cool Thing of his choice subject to GM veto. His response? "I Pilot it with MY BRAIN". Ummm, okay, he guides the Coracle with his LOG score, not really unbalancing, right? And while the Coracle levitates two feet above any surface it still has a Move of 1...

That's when the Player shows me his Land Oar-a stick with a Boot on it. And while I fall to the floor convulsed in laughing spasms, he shows me his improvised sailing rig using his cloak and the stick...and begins calculating his maximum speed with a Temp Weather Rune. And then he announces that his Familiar is a baby Velociraptor-

(GM BANGS HEAD ON TABLE, STILL LAUGHING)

Still, the Player's using 'Badger-sized Meat-eater' for the template just like I asked him to, it's not a game-breaker or anything-just scales instead of fur, right? Then I started to notice the extra Stats per Level of Enchanter and realized that if this PC continues to take levels in Enchanter, then by Level 4 or so this Velociraptor will be strong enough to carry the Dwarf on its back and smarter than some merchants...I may have to change that rule later.

I'm not saying this PC is powerful or anything-just really, really WEIRD.

Meanwhile, the Other PCs are in the village regaling the local Youth with tales of Adventure and Glory. Between Leader Level 1, Thief Level 1 with Secondary and Scholar Level 1 with Secondary, the three PC's are trying for some weird synergy of Leader, Diplomat and Deception to recruit a team of impressionable non-combatant Monster-fodder...I let the dice fall where they may(Playtest after all) and it gets really Pied Piper in the village square...

Oh well. I pick up Maidens of Moordoth-

-and have a sudden horrible nightmare vision of all those poor, amazed Ghouls assaulted by this Lunatic Enchanter, speeding down the side of a cliff face in a Flying Coracle he pilots with his brain, doing fly-bys with a Oar while his pocket Velociraptor hisses at them and lunges at the occasional rotted ear. And just rounding the corner are three Mighty Heroes urging on a mob of children armed with rocks and sticks-

Soooooo, I slide the module back into my attache and wing it-because there is NO WAY I am letting these weirdoes anywhere near Keranak. THIS playtest will take place on DISCWORLD, so swears the GM!

It's not the Rules you have to watch, it's the PLAYERS... :o

And that's why I love this game - possibilities, not limitations. :P

ROFLMAO! :D

Awesome post.

A level 1 enchanter takes some time while in town to create two special arrows (2 x enchanter level), he would define a trigger for each. For instance, when my arrow hits it releases thorny vines (entangle spell). The other arrow is fired, when I say Mal'cha! it releases a high pitch sonic scream stunning foes in a 3 space area (offensive strike). The GM rules it will do no damage but rather stun all within 3 spaces wide and 10 spaces long.

If the enchanter were to create the rune while in combat, it takes 1D turns and -20 penalty to the skill check.

We left this open for GM's, some might want to limit while others might not. Some GM's might require a caster check for each arrow, crit fail and something bad happens. Some might say you can make a number of arrows equal to STR/10.

Yes you could make a bunch, hand them out and mop up a lot of creatures. Or what-if the party is fighting a powerful enemy, they might require such a force.

Well, my Enchanter player (he of the Coracle landspeeder and baby Velociraptor Familiar) has noticed the Limit of Temp Runes and the Cost of making Magic Arrow-enchanting devices...but he has also noticed that Potions have no limitations save money, Skill and time. He is now asking how much gold it would take to make enough 'Lightning Bolt Juice' to coat an entire quiver of arrows...

(And now I can be almost certain that one or more of my players are lurking on this Forum-CURSES, I was hoping to keep it secret for just a little while longer!)

I helpfully point out that according to the rules as written, potions are 'imbibed' and of 'limited duration'. His counter-"can't arrows 'imbibe' a potion by dipping them?".

His logic is impeccable. So-aware of my GM Veto powers-he devised the following recipie:

Arrow Dip-the recipies for Arrow Dip are as varied as the effects they engender, and nearly all of them require expensive minerals as part of the effect (Ruby for Flame, jade for Entangling, Black Sand for Sleep, Alabaster for Transformation, Diamond Dust for Lightning etc). The resulting potion has a Concentration according to the Level of enchanter just as any other Enchanted item, and may be smeared on one missle or divided among multiple missles according to the Concentration of the potion. Once the potion is applied it can be washed away by the elements or dry into uselessness within minutes, so it is wise to employ the Arrow Dip just before an expected battle, or even during combat with the usual penalties for Multi-actions. If the missle misses it's target the Dip may remain active for several minutes, leading to desperate combatants picking them up as one-use Improvised melee weapons or accidents after the combat if the winners are in the habit of salvaging missles.

I LOVE it when my Players do the heavy lifting! THEY CARE! :)

I think I didn't state the first part clearly. My question is, creating a rune allows you to then "cast" the spell from the rune. For instance, I create a wand with Offensive strike as a rune, then use it to "cast" a Lightning Bolt. What if I prepare the run to cast it to charge a weapon? This isn't a functon of the rune, but of casting Offensive Strike. (In other words, an Enchanter can 'cast' it off a rune, just like a Spellcaster casts it from wiggling his fingers). Wouldn't the Enchanter then be able to make a whole quiver full of charged arrows just like a Spellcaster?

It takes either 1D minutes (or 1D Turns at a -20% penalty) to create a Rune from scratch. But yes, if Offensive Strike were prepared as a Temp Rune you could have up to two per Enchanter Level prepped to go at Enchanter Level of Effect, and then the Enchanter could drop behind cover and hope he has time to inscribe a Reload.

Now if an Enchanter Level 3 had 6 Offensive Runes Possible (each at a maximum of 4D extra Potency) an easygoing GM MIGHT allow the Enchanter to inscribe them all ON THE QUIVER, activating each Rune at will and assigning extra OOMPH on each arrow as he pleases. In theory, he could add 1D to each arrow as he pulls it until running out of Rune power or arrows, or he could activate EVERY RUNE AT ONCE and hand over the 18D+2 Dragon Killing Missle to the Elf Sniper with instructions to NOT MISS!

I think it would depend on the GM at that point. I mean, a Level 4 Spellcaster can punch out 5D Offensive Strikes every Round so it might not be a fealbreaker or anything...

What I'm getting at though is the enchanter doesn't necessarily have to put a rune on each arrow. He can put it on a rock, then 'cast' it to charge an arrow, then move on to the next one. It'd take him several hours to do a full quiver, but wouldn't that be possible with the rules as written?

order99 to Player - "You need to drink the potion and puke on the arrow. Give me a WIL check to force yourself to puke." lol

Neolithicwolf, spellcasters bring magical forces to bear and cast if they have at least one hand free and can speak freely. Enchanters carve runes (magic symbols that contain a power/spell) and define a trigger which is used to unleash the stored magic. They don't "cast" spells.

I mentioned this on G+, my halfling scout/enchanter trains wolverines to kill orcs on sight (they destroyed his entire warren). He shaves runes of protection in their fur, when the wolverines are attacked by an orc the rune is triggered (after the first attack the physical-protection spell goes off).

So.. there is nothing stopping your caster from casting OF on a bunch of arrows, spears, swords, hands, etc. There's nothing stopping creative players to do some down-right cool (and annoying) stuff. Nothing can cover every situation but as the GM think of how the player could accomplish their intent. Is the caster sitting in his room at the Blind Pig Inn casting OF on the parties weapons? Maybe the proprietor has a level in spellcating, detects the cast and kicks the party out on the street. WE don't serve your kind here. Or. My first inn was burned down by a cast that backfired, OUT you go. Perhaps tell your player that casing OF 10 times in a row has a toll on your body, he will be fatigued for 48 hours.

Creative players require creative responses. :-)

It's good we talk about this stuff and see how others are handling situations at their table. Hopefully I'm making a smidgen of sense!

(PC mistakes Arrow Dip of Lightning for Potion of Healing and drinks it)
(Pc realizes mistake and ponders while battle rages)
(PC shrugs shoulders, picks biggest, baddest foe on battlefield-a Giant-and runs at him with hand outstretched)
(There is Earth-shattering KABOOOM!!!)
(PC is now at center of 10 Space crater)
(Enemy flees)
(Allies flee)
(Battle over-outcome...indecisive)
(PC decides to Color Code bottles in future)

The big question regarding the Runes is this-once Offensive Strike is cast, how long does the Casting last on the missles? A few Rounds, an hour, or until some adorable orphan finds it centuries after the battle and cuts her finger with it (OUCH!)?

Since duration is unclear, i'd probably tell my PC Enchanter that, once cast, the effects last 'a short period of time' just like Potions. So in theory, A Level 1 Enchanter could have two Temp Runes, activate and empower the arrows, have time to create another Rune (perhaps two if taking the 'hasty' penalty) and have a full quiver of Enchanted Missles that have a few minutes to a half-hour 'charge' on them. OR you the GM could simply rule 'permanent until discharged' but every battle involving Spells would then be a Minefield for decades...

One of those 'Grey Areas' my PCs will likely attempt to exploit soon. :?

I just recieved an e-mail from the Enchanter PC:

PC-hey, can I paint Runes on my familiar and use him as a Thrown Weapon? I read about this guy with Wolverines and it sounds cool!

Me-Thank you for admitting that you found the DWD Forums, hope you enjoy the contents.
YES you can do a fly-by on your wicker and skin Speederbike and perform a Fastball Special with a baby Velociraptor. And yes, at Level 1 Enchanter you can ink two Runes of Offensive Strike programmed to go off on a CHOMP. In theory, you cute lil' reptile missle can deliver up to 6D with one bite-but are you prepared to lose the poor beastie in combat when the target's buddies decide to retaliate? Don't forget that Sliver is your Bestest Buddy Ever, and that you will feel his Death IN YOUR BRAIN.

PC-Good Point. Hey, can our Dwarf with Scout Primary train an entire flock of baby Velociraptors?

Me-In theory he can TRY, but since no one's ever seen one before i'm not going to tell you the odds.

PC-So where did I get mine if nobody on the Disc has seen one before?

ME-YOU TELL ME.

(later)

PC-Sent you a Text file.Please don't hit me.

Sooooo apparently the Enchanter found some mysterious Lost World somewhere east of the uncharted XXXX continent when his Magic Coracle had to ride out a Monsoon! With help from the easygoing natives he (just barely) made it back to Ankh-moorpork...

GOOD NEWS EVERYONE! The Clacks are alive with rumors that a party of gibbering fools-I mean, Intrepid Explorers are soliciting funds for an expedition into Uncharted Waters to find WherethebloodyheckamI Island! I am officially off the hook for Adventure Plotting Duty and will merely be staying a few steps ahead of the PCs as they write their own saga from scratch!

THEY LOVE ME! They are doing ALL THE WORK! :)

Runes are not cast, they are carved, inked, stitched, painted, etc. They go off by a trigger, they don't fade (unless the enchanter dies). As written, you surely don't have to follow. It just seems that it's unclear how runes work. :-/

Many of the things that are "unclear" in the game are that way because Larry and Bill want to leave such clarifications up to the GM. So in this case, the GM determines how runes work.

Exactly. But Neolithicwolf was postulating that one could activate the Rune for the effect, then transfer the effect to the target (the missles) then fire the missle at the missle's target with the effect intact and try to create more Runes before it 'wears off'-essentially a type of workaround of the Rune Limitations. My resonse was pretty much a "if you do this it raises THESE questions you'll need to answer" reply.

It might be easiest simply to invoke the Runes Don't Work That Way Because It Makes My Head Hurt rule on this one, especially with MY unruly band! Mileage may vary as always of course.

Very close. The only difference being, the determiner here is how long the damage added to a weapon lasts, which was where Larry was going. Basically, adding the damage is a function of using a spell, whether you're using it as a wand with runes on it or a Spellcaster directly casting it on the arrow. Another example, perhaps more easy to see.

Say I buy a nice big steel file, and I paint a few runes of OS on this file. The effect is stated as "To charge a weapon with Offensive Strike when the weapon is sharpened upon this file" Then I run a few arrows or swords or whatever over the file. My weapons are now charged and the runes are expended.

My intent isn't really so much to take away the limit of runes, but that this is something the normal Offensive Strike spell does unlimited (as written). Why should Enchanters have a more arbitrary limit just because they use runes? It seems unfair to the Enchanter.

I think a nice workaround might be to have the Spellcaster variant last a turn per level, and the rune version, provided the rune is actually placed on the item, last until discharged. I can't wait until my Warrior/Enchanter in my sons game gets to lvl 6 Enchanter. I am ssooooo gonna put a perma rune of Offensive Strike on my sword for an additional 7D damage.

That leads me to another thought. Why is it a Permanent rune costs 10 Str, but making a magic item doesn't unless you roll poorly. Has anyone thought of a different system for creating permanent spells? I'm not fond of the whole lose 10 STR thing.

It does seem strange that a permanent Item only costs 10 STR on a failure within 20 points and 0 STR on a success or greater-but then again Permanent Runes don't require Special Ingredients, nor do they have penalties to the Creation roll,nor is there a chance of wasting time and ingredients on a bad roll.

Permanent Runes only take 1D days(as opposed to many weeks)days and no special ingredients. Not sure if I like the 10 STR cost regardless of success or failure, but at least you have no penalties to the Skill roll-at Skill 6 and Decent LOG score you are ALMOST certain to succeed. Now I might houserule that no STR is lost on a failure-overall though, permanent Runes are MUCH easier then Magic Items-but you can at least try Magic Items at Enchanter Level 1 as opposed to Level 6. Evens out I suppose.

As far as the STR cost bit, I suppose you could try any number of variations:

1) My bizarre Enchanter PC player suggested this one-instead of spending STR, you should 'bank' some unused DP and invest the DP into the item or Permanent Rune instead.

2) Related to Number 1-the PC can spend 10 of any Ability instead, simulating the pouring of 'heart and soul' into it. Let the PC tap DEX, INT or WILL if desired on a case-by-case basis.

3) Time-rather than spend any Ability Scores the Caster must spend an entire day of time preparing-permanent effect is achieved on Doubles Success or a '00'. This means a permanent effect may take days or weeks of the caster's time and risks the occasional Critical Failure for over-abusing the power.

4) Sacrifice-a living, intelligent creature of 10 Body Points or more (average NPC) or a non-sapient creature or creatures totaling 30 Body Points or more must be sacrificed ritually (1D hours) in order to 'seal' a permanent effect. Atmospheric option for a nice Sword-and-Sorcery fell, but I can already predict easy abuse in many campaigns...

5) Attunement-the STR or other ability total cost is paid for by whomever the effect is 'Attuned' to, and the Effect only lasts until the death of the owner or client, after which the Effect is 'dormant' but still present. A Noble could commission a mighty Magic Blade which only he can use, and pays the Price-at the end of his career he could 'transfer' the ownership of the blade to an heir or disciple through a simple Cleric, Enchanter or Spellcaster ritual...a legendary Item stolen/taken by force from its rightful owner would not work for the new one, but the possessor could then become the new owner by dint of hiring an Enchanter to 're-attune' (simple Skill Check) and pay the Ability Tithe, thereby 'unlocking' the Effects again.

6) My Soul Lies in These Treasures-The caster pays no cost for any permanent Effect, ever. BUT-the Caster may have no more permanent effects active than his WILL/10. If the caster wishes to undo a Permanent effects he or she must be near the item or place. Furthermore, anyone attempting to effect the Caster may use a Place or Item the Caster has Enchanted in place of the Wizard for range purposes-but the caster in turn will sense this...in other words, the Effect and the Caster are linked in true Sympathy until the Effect is unmade or the Caster dies-in case of the latter the Effect is still permanent as that part of the Wizard's 'essence' was never recalled.
The above option has far-reaching Mystic implications. A Cleric who has consecrated many lands has become Of the Land-enemies may target the Cleric with a curse using any of these places as if the Cleric were nearby-at the same time the Cleric will feel which location is being used and cast Spells right back through the same place as if he or she were present-identifying the culprit with a measly Level 1 Divination, Entangling the enemy with the lands plantlife from a kingdom away, etc. A prudent Wizard will lay permanent enchantments on his own flesh only, unraveling and rebuilding them as she becomes more potent-more compassionate ones may cast them on boon companions in order to aid them(and to know when one is in pain or dying). Those who feel it worth the risk may enchant a set of Magic Rings perhaps, with great sorceries that both empower and enslave, in order to create a band of powerful puppets to do your will, and to know what they see and hear...but with each Ring linked to you your enemies might find a way through your puppets to YOU.

I feel that the first two Options I listed are mere tweaks-but the other ones(3, 4 an 6 in particular) could be real Game-changers if used. At any rate, let me know what results if you use one at your table...

I like 4 5 and 6 (not sure about with or without the sympathy though, but just limit it to (LOG or WIL)/10 seems limit enough). I suppose my fundamental issue is I don't like "charging" the character points that were granted to develop his character. Kind of like when AD&D started using Experience points to enchant items. I wasn't on board with that either. How can one lose an experience? Even if measured in points, if the idea is that my experiences make me who I am, then I can't suddenly go stupid and lose my memories, though I suppose considering their magic system (which I also always hated and changed to spell points) it makes sense from their mentality. I shall continue to ponder.

Anyone else have any other ideas? I am all open to suggestions.

Hmmmmm...

7-'My Soul Lies in...'Revised. A Caster may make a Permanent Spell whenever required. This requires 1D days to 'reinforce' the spell to permanent status. Enchanters follow the usual guidelines to create Permanent Runes or Magic Items. None of these things cost the caster STR under these guidelines, but the total number of permanent effects can never exceed WILL/10 for any combination of permanent Spell, Rune or Item, even if the Caster no longer possesses it. In order to 'reclaim power' from a permanent Spell, Rune or Enchantment, the caster must be within touching distance of the place or item, and roll the Appropriate Spellcaster, Cleric or Enchanter Skill(minus 10% per Level of invested Spell) to 'break' the Spell. If this check fails, the caster must instead 'unravel' the Spell over 1D days in the same manner it was created.

7A-The Sauron Option.May be added to Option 7 or not as per GM preference and campaign flavor. Depending on the GM's desires, this could be either in effect all of the time or by the PC Caster's Choice. If this option is used with Option 7, then any locations or items not touching the caster are subject to jasles' Sympathetic Magic rule-

http://dwdstudios.com/node/998

-and it works both ways. In addition, any caster so targeted this way will know where the location of the personal item or area immediately.Please note that a Caster with a high Skill could cast permanent Protection on him or herself in order to lessen or even eliminate vulnerability to malign magics while keeping the divinatory 'bonus'...

An Option with Options and a bit more detail...more what you were trying for?